poetry critical

online poetry workshop


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when should i write poetry?  cadmium  21 May 17 8:58PM Thread Closed

i'm not a poet unless i'm writing a poem. even after i've finished one, i'm not a poet, just a reader. readers aren't poets. we don't read poetically, don't get into an arty dress and feel the tragic/comic sense of life passing through our lips as we recite some poem.

i'm not a poet because i feel poetic and start saying beautiful thoughts in a cute way; i'm not hemingway, faking out a macho. i'm not dylan or morrison, faking out a rimbaud rap to get liked; watching them watch me, saying to the crowd, "written poetry is dead, the only real's what you do in bed." i'm not that 'do you like me, mr.?' kid anymore.

i'm not a poet when i write poetic prose, cutified lawn fauns, like i do. nor are you.

i feel verbal, feel like making words. i start by saying stuff, lie to the page -- "the air is round and my heart is high."

i've no idea what this really means, but i see 'air' and 'heart'. that's the core, and i can visualize and make the necessary connection between them -- 'heart is like...', 'air is like...'. if i can find a connection that FEELS emotional to me, i can start to write poetry.

'heart opens, air closes,
life slips in.
you take off your shirt
slip in the covers
sleep alone'

now i'm at the point where i should start writing poetry, try to find the real in this and what i really want to talk about. start seeing this shirt and this bed -- the things the reader can see -- and wonder what they've really got to do with me.

there's a problem with poetry today. inferior teachers are teaching us that anything you like is real, without showing you more to like than what they know or can handle. you're not a poet because you feel poetic, you're a poet because you've written something you can see in a year and not cringe at, because you've honestly worked to find the poetry in the poem you're writing.

this is just my opinion, and all writing is an experiment. i look forward to reading what other writers here think is real about poetry for the poet.

re: when should i write poetry?  AlchemiA  21 May 17 11:05PM Thread Closed

Eros-Thanatos conflicts abound round this whirl'd of word-wander

-- A Poet is like a trail-blazer, is like a 'scout' with eyes for something derp'd, they run over the arc of this rolling whirl'd; and they'd run and run, looking hither and thither, then they'd switch-back their eyes from the blind-spot that confabulates the looking-hole with what we all think we know ... you see: our brain makes-up things to fill-in the blanks, so ya' have to send someone askew-of-you, someone who doesn't really know what you'd always do, someone who'd 'wonder' off the beaten-path, someone that can simply-see through this scotoma-hole filled in by the brain, ya-know ...

-they'd detect something derp'd in the blind-spot we all call home-

she thinks they're ?¿ intertextual-fugues ?¿ -- that they're another mythos ЯOЯЯIM:MIRROR that's cracked and makes for many reflections, many "meme's 'n murmurs" and "twitters 'n tweets" which become complete in her, she reads this omen-nomenclature, and prognosticates just-in-time...

"There ain't no answer. There ain't gonna be any answer. There never has been an answer. That's the answer." - Gertrude Stein

re: when should i write poetry?  cadmium  21 May 17 11:31PM Thread Closed

this is ok, but what is it that the poet discovers or uncovers? paris? is there a difference between poetry writing a story about paris and a poem about paris? doesn't the story just tell about things happening in time, and doesn't the poem invent time itself so that the reader's consciousness is changed into 'time-reality' and therefore emptied of bigotry and opinion? whereas the story plays on the readers bigotry and cliche and pre-conceptions to interest the reader to keeping reading? and, doesn't just listing nice things also play the reader?

you know, when i met ginsberg for the first time i was about 20. and, i showed him my writing. and, he didn't talk about how wonderful a poet spirit i had, just that i wasn't spelling my words in a way that the reader could quickly grasp -- i was 'playing with words'... that's what he said about the words i'd written in phonetic to carry a feeling of the street and how people really talked. and, certainly ginsberg must have been a poet, right? i mean, everyone knows that -- all his crappy lists of nice things and things that made him uncomfortable -- mostly uncomfortable because he was such an outsider and didn't want to be... wanted people to see him as the guru, but really only liked high-class people and thought everyone else, including little beat poets in 1966, were either to be fucked or ignored because they were 'them'.

but, really, the reality is is that if you're trying to only say pretty things, you've got to say them in song instead of just listing them like beads you're trading with the primitives for a kiss. primitives have germs, alc.

re: when should i write poetry?  PollyReg  25 May 17 9:34PM Thread Closed

rar. I don't know about all this stuff, but everytime I comment on your poems you delete them, cadmium, that's super annoying

re: when should i write poetry?  cadmium  25 May 17 11:31PM Thread Closed

i'm deleting work that's not going anywhere. i've explained to you that this is a poetry workshop and that i post to get critique and to work the poem -- to find the poem in the poem. it's a writer's thing.

re: when should i write poetry?  PollyReg  25 May 17 11:44PM Thread Closed

uh-huh, but its not good etiquette.

that heroin 'microfiction' or what ever it was, with bubba Robert and co, was here for some time before you deleted it.

did you really want a serious critique? and not just a chat?

the grammar wasn't good, it shifted tense and person and was hard to follow. perhaps it was supposed to paint a certain scene, but even if that was the case, the author 'opinion' seemed too heavy handed, so as a character portrait it failed.

it was more like a "i'm more moral and of higher class than these people," sort of tale and what's the point of that?

I was left thinking, "and..."

re: when should i write poetry?  cadmium  26 May 17 12:38AM Thread Closed

it was only here three days and your comments weren't helpful; the piece never got beyond being a joke. sometimes the best edit is to just drop it and write another piece. i've been writing for sixty years now and have trashed at a rate of about 90 to 1. it's not about being liked, it's about talking seriously with other writers who are serious about finding the writing inside the typing. it's ok to be serious in a writer workshop.  in fact, that's the only important thing itself about writing -- you find out what you really can write and how you can write it. but, it helps if you've got a critique who knows what they're doing so they can see what you're doing. sometimes that happens but not often.

re: when should i write poetry?  PollyReg  26 May 17 1:31AM Thread Closed

The fart part was funny.

re: when should i write poetry?  cadmium  26 May 17 2:19AM Thread Closed

well, there you are. it worked after all on you. but, that's not very satisfying for me. i mean, i could read it to a dog and get the same whimper. story's got to get the reader into writing their own story.


re: when should i write poetry?  PollyReg  26 May 17 10:00AM Thread Closed

If I see something written like that and it seems to be pointing out unpleasantries (or what the author thinks is unpleasant) in others...I wonder why...

It wasn't angry enough to be cathartic.

You've said before you don't really like addicts or drunks. But I know that mean and stupid people are just mean and stupid people, regardless of whether they are drunk or stoned.

I've known plenty of both varieties

If seems to me that poem was written (or posted at least) to some sort of purpose...and I'm sure my replies were VERY satisfying. But I'm not sure why and I won't dwell on it...

I can't afford to dwell on it.

People's lives are full of all sorts of stories. Good, bad, funny, horrific, loving.

People get on a website like this, sometimes, and cultivate. an idealised version of themselves...

...that's fine, I do it too, but unfortunately I need a full hand of cards to be able to access my own writing. I need all my truths regardless of whether they hold me up to a flattering light.

I'll sit now. Thanks.

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